UK Foreign & Commonweath Office & GNR - WARNING

[James Faro]

Firstly, there is free movement of goods, inasmuch as you are perfactly entitled to take your vehicle into any EU state, and keep it there for up to six months providing you stay with it. That is the law in Portugal, and it is also the law in UK, and to the best of my knowledge it is the law in every other EU state. It has been the law for at least 40 years in the UK to my certain knowledge and probably for a good deal longer. Why should you use Portuguese roads on a semi permanent basis, unless you pay the appropriate road taxes, and meet other legal requirements, MOTs, insurance etc.
Secondly, on the subject of Duty Free discounts, you appear to be unaware that there is NO import duty between EU states. That being so, how can any citizen travelling between EU states expect to have a duty free discount! EU citizens travelling to countries outside of the EU are entitled to duty free as they've always been.

For the first part of your argument there are many case laws where there has been contravention of the free movement principle(involving transport) and some cases have succeeded and some not brought before the European court. I believe there are already two cases pending on the sort restrictions that Portugal is now enforcing but it is different member states who are being reported on, Free movement has been interpreted as no hindrance and that means post-six months jobsworths employed by member states imposing fines are technically in breach of free movement. No doubt the European court will make a ruling to settle the issue.

The spirit of the original treaties and subsequent ratifications of it to acceding member states has made things complicated!

The abolition of import duties between member states is not what it seems. To claw back the revenue lost the EU decided to abolish the duty-free travelers enjoyed in the EU only. The result of the duty free ban( that was finally phased out by 1999) was that the the goods were more expensive and resulted in a drop of demand from the manufacturers goods. It is a case of giving money back to industry and clawing it from individuals by imposing duties on goods.

The commissioners of the EU and indeed all high ranking officials still enjoy duty-free purchase status. There is a voluntary code of conduct that they will not exercise this right as opposed to a mandatory ban like the rest of us on earth! It is frequently flouted as a voluntary code is not mandatory.

[Bruce Wallis]

Simple.......

There are UK registered cars without current UK tax or MOT. Some years out of date.

Those car owners deserve to get hammered.

We had our car down in the Algarve for 6 months at a time, 2 years running....and being hassled by the GNR on a regular basis is a pain!!

Buying a Portuguese car is bloody expensive, yes...but if you want to live there...you have to take the rough with the smooth, so we bought ourselves a small portuguese car....and we are very happy with the arrangement.

It's nice to stand with a leg in both camps, and take whatever advatage you can of both systems...but at the end of the day, you need to decide where you want to be.

We voted Portugal....warts and all.

[carvoeiro1]

Having a car here for over six months ok. But explain the English registered Chrysler doing airport transfers and taxi transfers from Carvoeiro which is ten years older or more.
No insurance. No mot. Explain how that helps the portuguese economy.
Dont the clients even ask how is it possible to do this when they arrive.

Dean Vogel Died this morning from a heart attack at Faro airport.

[laserblazer]

Having a car here for over six months ok. But explain the English registered Chrysler doing airport transfers and taxi transfers from Carvoeiro which is ten years older or more.
No insurance. No mot. Explain how that helps the portuguese economy.
Dont the clients even ask how is it possible to do this when they arrive.

Why did you quote this without adding a comment?

[ditzy]

I think it was edited following the news that Dean passed away this morning

[laserblazer]

I think it was edited following the news that Dean passed away this morning

Thanks

[Mike Banks]

Free movement has been interpreted as no hindrance and that means post-six months jobsworths employed by member states imposing fines are technically in breach of free movement. No doubt the European court will make a ruling to settle the issue.

Free movement of goods means that you are free to move your goods, cars incuded, anywhere you like within the EU without asking for anyone's permission. It does not mean that you can do so without a financial cost; if it did that would make all road tolls illegal wouldn't it?

[Mike Banks]

the abolition of import duties between member states is not what it seems.

It is exactly what it seems. There is no import duty between member states, therefore there can be no duty-free allowance. How can you rebate a charge which has not been levied?

Perhaps you are confusing Import Duty with Excise Duty. Exise Duty is levied on home sales and imports of certain goods, principally tobacco and alcohol. There are similar duties, but at different rates in other EU states, but EU citizens are allowed to bring in unlimited amounts of such goods providing that they have been bought at a retail tax-inclusive price in the EU, AND they are for the importer's personal use. Obviously, if you bring in a Transit van full of brandy from France you might have some difficulty persuading the customs officer that you will be drinking it all yourself!

[James Faro]

Free movement has been interpreted as no hindrance and that means post-six months jobsworths employed by member states imposing fines are technically in breach of free movement. No doubt the European court will make a ruling to settle the issue.

Free movement of goods means that you are free to move your goods, cars incuded, anywhere you like within the EU without asking for anyone's permission. It does not mean that you can do so without a financial cost; if it did that would make all road tolls illegal wouldn't it?

I suggest you argue that out in the European Court when these test cases finally get the okay to be heard! Some public spirited individuals bring their governments to the EU court as they are contravening the principles enshrined in the treaty. That is the problem with EU laws especially the free movement of goods - it is not workable in practice.

[pat anderson]

Have you heard yourselves ?, or at least half of you. Portugal is up poop street without a paddle and you are complaining about paying legally required taxes ? Give me a break. I left Portugal for Spain knowing it was coming and they would hit you where ever possible. Oh and by the way you now owe Spain 8 billion so if you can all buy a few new Portuguese cars their may actually stand a chance of getting it back.

[EMM]

If Portugal is iin the POOP Spain is so deep in the manure that it will never surface again.
Most Spanish banks have a " For Sale " sign outside as tey have huge toxic property loans.
Whatever can be said of the Portuguese they did not go down this route they left it to the Irish and other Banks to fuel their property boom.

[pat anderson]

No the Portuguese just stole the value of lifelong leases from anybody who is unfortunate to have one, many people losing thousands in collateral. The Spanish government is being totally fair with people who did not follow the building regulations law and in most cases changing the law to help them out and have bought several of the properties to help out the homeless . Spain is working towards solving their economic problems, both the people and government of Portugal are not even admitting there is a problem. There is noway they will pay back all that the other counties have lent them. They will spend the money and then do a runner from the EU.

Come to Spain and see how the locals work and do not rip you off, the difference between here and there is amazing, they know they have to be careful and are actually putting in the work in for a better future, not burying their heads in the sand or issuing all is well propaganda.

[EMM]

So the demonstrators who took over the centre of Madrid and Barcelona were there to support the actions of the government were they ?
It looks like Spain could follow Greece with the growing public discontent with the effects of their self inflicted economic crisis.

Ireland , Greece, Portugal, Spain . its just a matter of degree.

The Spanish debt numbers are so large that the EU has to find a solution otherwise the the EU will collapse like a pack of cards.

[pat anderson]

Yes thank you EMM at last someone sees my point - the Spanish are determined not to put there head in the sand and do something to stop their country going down the pan and thankfully the goverment are listening. Spain is determined not to have to agree to Germanies terms as Portugal has now had to . Portugal is fine - NOT !!!! pay taxes if you love the country fight for it and work for a better future. The UK are keeping these demo's quiet as they fear it could happen there - Portugal needs more freedom of speech, you need to know what is going on in the background demostrate if neccersary to get the truth for a change and insist on change. Small businesses that thrive here should have the same political backing there.

Spain cares - Portugal couldn't give a monkeys.

Auf Wiedersehen

[pat anderson]

http://curiouscapitalist.blogs.time.com ... bt-crisis/