Proper Architect

[Littlelegs]

hello Guest yes I did get your pm and have replied likewise

littlelegs

[shanagarry]

Well the answer from the Camara arrived on Thursday and it was not the one we expected.

Our property has a garage built on it (it was there when we bought it) which did not have planning permission. Earlier this year we applied for permission to extend the kitchen, which was granted and had the retrospective permission for the garage rolled into it.

They now tell me that the garage and the prospective kitchen extension plus a further 80m2 is all that I can have - as that is all that is permitted within the habitation licence granted when the place was first built.

To say I am amazed would be understating the position given the amount of development going on all around Cvo.

My first port of call is my lawyers who handled the purchase and did not pick up on the absence of permission for the garage - should I hold out any hope?

[Bruxinha]

Hi Shanagarry,

Sorry to hear things aren't going so well. Yes, definitely put in writing your complaint to the lawyer you used and copy it to the Bastionário i.e. the top dude at the "Ordem dos Advogados". I will pm you with further information about this.

Lawyers in the Algarve.

[Guest]

Why are you surprised..I'm amazed that you seem surprised.....you must understand there is NO logic to camara decisions and the basic culture of Portuguese beauracrats...I have discussed this many times with Portuguese friends and they agree with me that it is a hopeless lost cause.you just have toi ride along with the nonsene wave .or go back to UK and suffer the weather and the M25......take your choice boyo.

[Bruxinha]

I don't disagree with what you are saying guest about there being no logic, as I know it to be more often than not true, but I think if everybody just thought, Oh well it is a lost cause, then we might as well sink Portugal into the Atlantic Ocean. If only more people, Portuguese and foreigners made more effort to complain, discuss, question attitudes here and got together to fight things, then Portugal might have some chance of going somewhere and not languishing behind the rest of Europe.

If you have complaints, ask for complaints books or write to governing bodies. Ask others if they have had problems with similar things or companies and get together to act as a united force. Things can happen. I've seen it. We musn't just lay down and accept things as they are, be it in the UK, Germany, France or Portugal. We must try at least to act for the common good of people. You might not always succeed but you can't fail unless you try.

Just recently I have seen some signs of change in Portugal, in trying to clean their act up, in terms of corruption and fraud. I hope it continues.

As an example I have recently had pm's and correspondence from various people concerning a company that has caused a lot of problems. If only I could get all those people together to go forward I think we may have a good chance of getting somewhere, individually I fear we may not. Have courage people and think of others, who might suffer a similar fate as you.

[nightrider]

Sorry Guest,

Sadly, more often than not there is a more serious underlining problem, then you state in your letter, together with the fact that many do not speak Portuguese from the UK. As you have not registered as a member, I am unaware if you are a resident in the UK or here in the Algarve. However, considering and with respect your somewhat naive statement, I can only assume the Uk.

Nightrider:

[shanagarry]

I have gone on record here many times regarding the cowardly way some correspondents hide behind the 'guest' pseudonym - what is their problem?

What I don't need is for your critical sarcasm to over-ride the common sense remarks made by posters whose names are there for us all to see. If you can't or will not offer something constructive - stick to day time TV.

For the record we do live in the UK and if you had followed the thread of this post you will see that we are preparing the way for a permanent move to Cvo in September 2008 or sooner.

My amazement is not at the decision by the Camara, I did have an expectation of something more constructive, but had not raised my hopes - my amazement is at the way my Lawyer overlooked the issue regarding the garage that I now know was constructed 8 years earlier. I suspect she will say it was not on the plans she was working from and short of going to the property, how was she to know - or something along those lines.

[Homme Poco]

Have you considered converting the existing garage into part of your living area(if it would work).Then build new "garaging" under the new extensions.
I think that the areas underground do not count in the build area,you can then have light shafts down to these rooms.
Just
an idea,one you may have already thougt of.
Good luck
HP

[shanagarry]

Hi HP

Its good to get back to the sensible people - thank you.

The suggestion you made is a good one but the garage is away from the house and would probably have to be demolished to accommodate your suggestion. I like the idea of having the garage underneath but one of the major concerns in all of this is the indirect costs.

Not the cost of doing the work and fitting it out - the ancillary costs of Lawyers, Planners and Architects - all who seem to have a penchant for stringing things out. They are no different to their counterparts in the UK.

I mentioned earlier that one of our options may be to buy something larger - which could be the least expensive option in the long run. For now I am waiting to hear from the Lawyer with her explanation before we make any decisions.

Thanks for your helpful suggestion - it is appreciated.

[pedro_architect]

Hi, I am a young chartered architect currently in Lagoa (county) nearby Carvoeiro and I was googling about architects in Carvoeiro.
I was shocked with the comments on this post about your experiences with local architects (or whatever they are) so on behalf of my professional community I am very sorry for that

I have my professional card since 2008 and have heard about similar "stories" not only with foreign but also with local Portuguese customers.
In that year (2005) architects salaries in Portugal were conducted by legal pre established prices (as it happens in Germany right now for example); but nowadays those formulas are not being used any more (unfortunately for me).

Depending on the urgency of your needs... to choose an architect I recommend you to think about how you would choose a dentist; you will probably give preference on a dentist recommended by a relative.

Moreover you don't need a lawyer before going to the dentist I guess.

Even though the hard fight, I believe that this new generation of architects is making an effort to reduce that corruption paradigm.

[laserblazer]

Welcome pedro-architect. It's good to have an expert join us. Did you notice that this thread is 7 years old?

[pedro_architect]

thanks
yes I realized that