Cecol Accountants

Share experience regarding ownership of property and/or living in Portugal.

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Geoff
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Re: Cecol Accountants

Post by Geoff »

But will they still?
I'll tell you that when the next IMI bills come out ( May?).....interesting, see Portugal News 13 Dec 2019 https://www.theportugalnews.com/news/du ... tive/52334

viz:
There are two types of Fiscal Representation in Portugal:
• Fiscal Representation in Personal Income Tax (“IRS”)
• Fiscal Representation in VAT
Appointing a Fiscal Representative
It is mandatory to appoint a Fiscal Representative whenever a third-country national who is not resident in Portugal has income arising in Portugal. Alternatively, although residing in the national territory, an individual is absent for a period exceeding six months and obtains income in Portugal subject to Portuguese taxation. For a non-resident to start the process of appointing a tax representative in Portugal, the taxpayers must have a Fiscal Number (“NIF”) and a password (“senha”) to be identified on the Finanças Portal.
.....which rather implies that if you don't have Portuguese income nor are liable to VAT, then you don't need a Fiscal Rep...

Algarve Tax Solutions state : www.algarve-taxsolutions.com/pdf/repres ... fiscal.pdf

viz:
Who needs Fiscal Representation in Portugal?
Non-resident taxpayers who earn taxable income in Portugal & the Algarve are
required to appoint a fiscal representative who guarantee’s that the non-resident is
compliant with Portugal’s tax obligations. B
...which again implies that if you don't have Portuguese income nor are liable to VAT, then you don't need a Fiscal Rep...
djprescott
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Re: Cecol Accountants

Post by djprescott »

I have had my IMI tax documents sent to my UK home address for about 4 years now. Will be interesting if I receive them this year but I guess I will find out soon!
RichardHenshall
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Re: Cecol Accountants

Post by RichardHenshall »

I imagine that I'm not alone among non-resident property owners in having a Portuguese bank current account paired with a deposit account. The interest earned on the deposit account, although tiny these days, might be enough to make you a (taxable) income earner in Portugal. I know that withholding tax is deducted from any interest paid but ...
sam
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Re: Cecol Accountants

Post by sam »

djprescott wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 1:32 pm I have had my IMI tax documents sent to my UK home address for about 4 years now. Will be interesting if I receive them this year but I guess I will find out soon!
Same here. We do not have any income in Portugal. A solicitor has advised us to wait and see. I assume we are now as any other non-EU resident and only need Fiscal Rep if getting income.
djprescott
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Re: Cecol Accountants

Post by djprescott »

Thanks Sam. Yes, we have no income in Portugal either so are in a similar position.
Geoff
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Re: Cecol Accountants

Post by Geoff »

Same here. We do not have any income in Portugal. A solicitor has advised us to wait and see. I assume we are now as any other non-EU resident and only need Fiscal Rep if getting income.
Thanks Sam. Yes, we have no income in Portugal either so are in a similar position.
Sam and Dave....I assume this means you don't have a Fiscal Rep? If so, we won't need one either ( hopefully) as long as I can get the IMI bills emailed to me!
PS....Haven't seen you and Hazel on a walk lately Dave?
sam
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Re: Cecol Accountants

Post by sam »

We do not have a fiscal rep. We have someone lined up in case we need one. You can do this on line, but need a lawyer's letter, which ours has said he can provide if needed. I assume this is to confirm the person is eligible to be a Fiscal Rep.
Geoff
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Re: Cecol Accountants

Post by Geoff »

I asked a Portuguese friend to contact the Financias to get a definitive view, and the feedback is :
According to the Finanças you have to have a Fiscal Representation. You don’t have any income generated in Portugal, but you own a property.

As for the IMI payment, you can do it through the bank on what we call direct payment, which means that the amount is taken from your bank account automatically. In this case you talk to your Fiscal Representative and he, according to your instructions will deal with both parties.

If for some reason you decide to end the collaboration with Sovereign, you can do so, but have to advise the Finanças. That can be done on line on Finanças web site. For this you would have to ask Sovereign to provide you with your code in order to log in, to enter the site and change the name to the new company name.
Think I'll just change to my solicitor & she can deal!
Farol
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Re: Cecol Accountants

Post by Farol »

Geoff wrote: Wed Feb 10, 2021 3:32 pm I asked a Portuguese friend to contact the Financias to get a definitive view, and the feedback is :
According to the Finanças you have to have a Fiscal Representation. You don’t have any income generated in Portugal, but you own a property.

As for the IMI payment, you can do it through the bank on what we call direct payment, which means that the amount is taken from your bank account automatically. In this case you talk to your Fiscal Representative and he, according to your instructions will deal with both parties.

If for some reason you decide to end the collaboration with Sovereign, you can do so, but have to advise the Finanças. That can be done on line on Finanças web site. For this you would have to ask Sovereign to provide you with your code in order to log in, to enter the site and change the name to the new company name.
Think I'll just change to my solicitor & she can deal!
So once IMI is being paid by direct payment/debit (irrespective of how it was set up or by whom) what does the Fiscal Representative do?
RichardHenshall
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Re: Cecol Accountants

Post by RichardHenshall »

Farol wrote: Wed Feb 10, 2021 7:06 pm So once IMI is being paid by direct payment/debit (irrespective of how it was set up or by whom) what does the Fiscal Representative do?
I take that you're asking what else they do other than deal with the admin caused by collecting fees from you? :wink:

I suppose they are exposed to issues if you fail to pay, perhaps especially so if you fail to declare or pay tax on any capital gains when you sell your property.
Geoff
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Re: Cecol Accountants

Post by Geoff »

So once IMI is being paid by direct payment/debit (irrespective of how it was set up or by whom) what does the Fiscal Representative do?
Our solicitor says :
I advise that the role of the fiscal representative has more to do with responsibilities to act with Portuguese authorities rather than the administrative work that involve.
and Sovereign say:
The fiscal representative is the interface between the individual and the tax department and is then jointly responsible with clients for any tax calculations relating to their property and / or to their individual taxes.

Basically clients pay the annual fee to us for being their contact here in Portugal and the only thing included in our fee is the receipt and forwarding of their rates bills. Obviously our fee covers all the contact with clients and many queries that they ask about are answered without a charge. We only really charge extra if we have to get involved in sorting out problems with the tax office, lawyers or other entities and then we charge on a time spent basis or as per our price list. Clients are paying for having the reassurance of knowing that all fiscal matters relating to their property here will be dealt with and that they will always be informed of any problems.

The tax department will only send the bills to you directly if you have an EU address. If they sent them to your Portugal address this would make you a tax resident in Portugal.
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