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Renting : Social Security Payments
Re: Renting : Social Security Payments
My understanding is that the Portuguese authorities will levy Social Security from 1 Jan 2016 to everyone who pays Portuguese Income Tax on property income UNLESS they can produce this A1.I am still sitting on my hands and - hopefully - under the radar.
So, not sure that hand-sitting is an option?
Re: Renting : Social Security Payments
Hmmm - our advisors Tax Angels have been hassling us about this A1 form all year. Like many others, I don't fit into any of their categories as I'm not retired and I don't pay any NI contributions in the UK so can't provide any of the following:
1. If Retired - pension statement;
2. If Employed – declaration confirming the payments made to social security in your home country (UK, Ireland, etc.);
3. If Self-employed – accountant declaration confirming yearly payment are being made to social security in your home country (UK, Ireland, etc.).
We went round in circles with letters to HMRC earlier this year with no resolution to this. We finally got through to a very helpful guy at HMRC a couple of weeks ago who, having access to my UK tax return records, over the phone changed my UK status to self employed for the small bit of teaching that I still do (but not enough to pay tax on), agreed that I don't need to pay additional Class 2 NI payments as income too low and then gave me a fax number to send the completed CA8421 form to, suggesting I ask them to treat it as a matter of urgency - their normal processing time is quoted as 3 months! We got the A1 certificate back within a week which I reckon was pretty good going. Have now given this to Tax Angels and hope that they know what to do with it and that this is the end of the matter - maybe wishful thinking?!
1. If Retired - pension statement;
2. If Employed – declaration confirming the payments made to social security in your home country (UK, Ireland, etc.);
3. If Self-employed – accountant declaration confirming yearly payment are being made to social security in your home country (UK, Ireland, etc.).
We went round in circles with letters to HMRC earlier this year with no resolution to this. We finally got through to a very helpful guy at HMRC a couple of weeks ago who, having access to my UK tax return records, over the phone changed my UK status to self employed for the small bit of teaching that I still do (but not enough to pay tax on), agreed that I don't need to pay additional Class 2 NI payments as income too low and then gave me a fax number to send the completed CA8421 form to, suggesting I ask them to treat it as a matter of urgency - their normal processing time is quoted as 3 months! We got the A1 certificate back within a week which I reckon was pretty good going. Have now given this to Tax Angels and hope that they know what to do with it and that this is the end of the matter - maybe wishful thinking?!
Re: Renting : Social Security Payments
Rang the revenue a couple of weeks ago you require an A1 Form,to get this you need first apply for a CA8421I, current waiting period once the revenue are in receipt of said form CA8421I is (get this is 78 days) not 7/8 days 78 days.Now I bet that surprised you not.
Re: Renting : Social Security Payments
Sorry everyone just noticed the previous entryPTBUXTON wrote:Rang the revenue a couple of weeks ago you require an A1 Form,to get this you need first apply for a CA8421I, current waiting period once the revenue are in receipt of said form CA8421I is (get this is 78 days) not 7/8 days 78 days.Now I bet that surprised you not.
Re: Renting : Social Security Payments
I got a reply in "only 42 days"...only trouble is, they say I don't work in the UK....which is true....but if the Portuguese think I am (self) employed renting out the house there, perhaps I can persuade the HMRC that I am self-employed in the UK doing the same?current waiting period once the revenue are in receipt of said form CA8421I is (get this is 78 days)
But if so, am I liable to pay Class 2 NI payments if retired and, are these more expensive than the Portuguese Social Security?
Re: Renting : Social Security Payments
That's exactly the point I entered the discussion with, so still sitting tight !Geoff wrote:But if so, am I liable to pay Class 2 NI payments if retired and, are these more expensive than the Portuguese Social Security?current waiting period once the revenue are in receipt of said form CA8421I is (get this is 78 days)
Re: Renting : Social Security Payments
An update...the accountants came up with lots of Portuguese forms to sign, but after about 4 months the Lisbon Tax/Social Security say that these forms ( plus various UK tax forms saying we don't need to pay NI) aren't good enough and you need an A1 if working or a P1 if a pensioner.
I located a reference to this :
http://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/wo ... ex_en.htm#
But can't see how to get the form....anyone had any success?
I located a reference to this :
http://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/wo ... ex_en.htm#
But can't see how to get the form....anyone had any success?
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Re: Renting : Social Security Payments
Geoff, the P1 is the form that you received when you retired stating how much they were going to pay you, so I am reliably informed.
The A1 have no idea.
The A1 have no idea.
Re: Renting : Social Security Payments
Thanks logicbob, I will have to rummage in my files when I get home.Geoff, the P1 is the form that you received when you retired stating how much they were going to pay you, so I am reliably informed.
The A1 have no idea.
The A1 is the form that could prove you pay UK NI if you are working in the UK.....there's a link above here on how to apply for one.
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Re: Renting : Social Security Payments
Thanks, that is very helpful Geoff.Geoff wrote:...you need an A1 if working or a P1 if a pensioner.
I located a reference to this :
http://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/wo ... ex_en.htm#
But has anyone worked out how to acquire a form P1 from the UK DWP ?
Re: Renting : Social Security Payments
Well, if Logicbob is correct, it will be sitting in my file when i get back.....but if you look at the Dept of Work & Pensions website, there's an email enquiry form you can send to your Pensions Office ( post code dependent) ...I had already done this yesterday and asked for a P1.But has anyone worked out how to acquire a form P1 from the UK DWP ?
Not holding my breath, but will update with any news.
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Re: Renting : Social Security Payments
e-richard wrote:Thanks, that is very helpful Geoff.Geoff wrote:...you need an A1 if working or a P1 if a pensioner.
I located a reference to this :
http://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/wo ... ex_en.htm#
But has anyone worked out how to acquire a form P1 from the UK DWP ?
Richard, as far as know there is no such form as a P1, I tried every department in the UK government and could not get anyone to tell me what it was. They just keep passing you on to the next department. The form that has been accepted in Portugal is the one that you receive when you retire advising you of your pension payments which is Form BR 2198.
Re: Renting : Social Security Payments
Well, I'm back in the UK and have found my BR2198.The form that has been accepted in Portugal is the one that you receive when you retire advising you of your pension payments which is Form BR 2198.
It doesn't look vastly different from the annual BR5899 you get from the DWP saying what the amount is for the coming year, but if you tink the BR2198 might work.......
No news from DWP on a P1....
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Re: Renting : Social Security Payments
Geoff wrote:Well, I'm back in the UK and have found my BR2198.The form that has been accepted in Portugal is the one that you receive when you retire advising you of your pension payments which is Form BR 2198.
It doesn't look vastly different from the annual BR5899 you get from the DWP saying what the amount is for the coming year, but if you tink the BR2198 might work.......
No news from DWP on a P1....
Geoff, you are correct I have just checked mine and the form BR 2198 is the first form and all subsequent forms are BR 5899. All I can say is that it has been accepted up to now but this is Portugal we are talking about so good luck. Let us know how you get on.
Re: Renting : Social Security Payments
Thanks....but the current year's BR5899 along with the current HMRC Tax code form ( saying NI not applicable) didn't work, so am not holdinmg my breath!All I can say is that it has been accepted up to now but this is Portugal we are talking about so good luck. Let us know how you get on.
Worst case scenario, how much is the Portuguese Social Security payment, anyone know please?